Wednesday, March 19, 2008

Iraq, 5 Years Later

I grew up with 5 uncles; only one of them survives. My Uncle Mickey is 63; recently retired from the Postal Service, he served in Vietnam with two lifelong friends. None of them talk about their Vietnam experience often, and when I was growing up in the seventies and eighties in Philadelphia, no Vietnam veterans EVER talked about their war experiences. Having grown up in a very working-class neighborhood, I knew quite a few men who’d served in Vietnam. My uncles and their buddies (both also close friends of my parents), my neighbor across the street (I babysat for his daughter), many of my friends’ parents, a teacher in high school…they’d tell you that they’d been to Vietnam, but would change the subject if you tried to ask them about it. The first time my uncle and his friends ever mentioned the subject in my presence was three years ago. We were at my mother’s house after the funeral of my next-to-last uncle, Tommy (he’d also been in Vietnam; he’d also never spoken about it). My Uncle Mickey called me over and said “wasn’t your father-in-law a ROK soldier”? My late father-in-law had indeed fought in the South Korean army, and he’d been in Vietnam, too. They all started talking about how the ROK soldiers were the toughest m-fers they’d ever met, but that Vietnam was “just like this crock of shit we’re in now…remember how they were always talking about the ‘coalition’, and it was us, the ROK soldiers, and a half-dozen Australians”. I wasn’t really thinking about what they were saying; it was just that amazing that they were actually talking to me about the war.

None of this is apropos of anything, except that I wonder now, 5 years after the invasion, how the war will affect those who are fighting it 20 or 40 years from now. Will they talk about it? Will they feel that they were fighting for a just cause, or will they be angry at the loss of years of their life toward a war they opposed? I’m sure there will be some of both.

I’m not the most insightful political commentator, and so my posts on politics are usually limited in number and in scope. This one isn’t much different. I’m still angry 5 years later that we were led by deliberate deception into such a destructive war, but do I know if we should pull out immediately, today?
I don’t, really.
I know 5 people (four in “real” life and one online) who have served in Iraq, and I don’t think any of them wants the US to pull out now. I’m not saying that I feel required to agree with them because they have been there and I have not. I’m saying only that I want to consider their opinion and respect their sacrifice. My uncles and their friends are still hurt and angry nearly 40 years after their return home at the indifference and contempt with which they were treated by fellow citizens. They didn’t fully understand the war they were fighting when they were 19 and 20 years old, but they made a tremendous sacrifice and they did their best. I hope that I can question this war without causing the same pain for those who have fought it, who have made such a sacrifice, and who have done their best.

If you're interested in more comments about the 5-year anniversary of start of the Iraq war, click here.

49 comments:

The Guv'ner said...

My God. Five years already. One of my friends lost her dad in Vietnam when she was three. That's my only connection to it, but I've yet to figure out exactly why America was involved to begin with. This war in Iraq still puzzles me because, weren't we looking for Bin Laden and doing shit in Afghanistan after 9/11? Wasn't that what this was all about? Where did Iraq suddenly factor in? Non existent WMAs based on intelligence from the Brits was enough to go in and destroy a country and countless lives of America and its allies over non definite information? Five years later I can't believe we are still there and it's as big a pig's ear as ever. Should we pull out immediately? It's a little late for that. You can't just go in someplace, blow seven shades of shit out of it, displace half the population, leave it running amok in insurgents and just say "See ya!" That's worse than going there at all in my opinion. It should never have happened but it has so we need to stay till it's finished. Blame that horse's ass in the White House and his advisors. Yup.

Well you did ask! :)

CDP said...

Yes, I did! And I'm glad you commented; it's nice to hear what you think of things other than Uberlords and Rod Stewart (who is certainly Scottish.)

Sauntering Soul said...

My older brother was in the Army and had to go to Iraq during the first Gulf War. He went back during the current war by choice working as a civilian training the Iraqi police force. He returned home last June and has said very, very little about it. His wife has told me he talks to her about it a tiny bit more but has said he never wants to tell anyone some of the things he saw while there. I will tell you my brother has been kind of a jerk since he returned. I don't know if it's due to his year in Iraq or other stuff going on in his life, but sometimes I quite honestly can't stand being around him.

He has said that he often had Iraqi citizens in broken English say "thank you" to him for what he was doing. One guy told him "tell your family I think you're a very good man". Whether or not the American citizens support this war, I'm glad the Iraqis recognize and appreciate the sacrifices made.

CDP said...

SS--me too. I hope your brother is able to recover from his experience, too.

dguzman said...

I only know one Vietnam vet; he was on a ship the whole time and never saw combat. He still supports Bush and the war, and he believes America deserves to go in and take Iraq's oil (or anyone else's) because we need it and because we're "God's country."

Sadly, not everyone learned the lessons of Vietnam.

Great post, CDP.

CDP said...

Thanks, D. As a person who actually does believe in God, I don't get when people assert that this country or any other is "God's"...obviously, they all are. I don't know much about my uncles' or their friends' combat experiences, but I do know that they were all younger than 21 and they were all on the front lines; having read about Vietnam a little bit, I can use my imagination to figure out exactly what kind of horrors they saw and experienced.

Robert Rouse said...

The major difference between Vietnam and Iraq is that Bush had an exit strategy from Vietnam. Joke aside, I know many of the Iraq Vets who are now openly opposing this war. The reason so many of them can talk about their experiences is because of outreach programs started and run by other Iraq vets. I've seen these guys reach soldiers on the brink of suicide. Now those same formerly suicidal soldiers are working with others. IVAW is much more than an ant-war organization.

Wyldth1ng said...

I respect your uncles and I hope peace comes to them when they are ready.

CDP said...

RR--I'm hopeful that more veterans who suffer as a result of this or any other war will be treated better than veterans in wars past.

Wyld--Thanks, and to you and your fellow Marines and soldiers too.

Mandy said...

great post!

CDP said...

Thank you!

DCup said...

I wish this war had never happened, but now it seems to be something we're stuck with.

No matter which party is in power, I'm thinking we'll be occupiers for many years to come.

Worker Mommy said...

It disgusts me that we're still fighting this ridiculous war five years later.
Pointless!

Suze's Sass said...

Great post. All I can say is "we've made a mess out of this". We can't just up and leave which means crap, we can't just up and leave. Ugh! My husband served over there during Operation Desert Storm for a year. He doesn't talk much about it, but he didn't see anything near the combat and conditions the soldiers have to deal with today.

Cathy Mullins said...

I was teaching high school when Desert Storm started. A student asked me if I was PROUD to be an American. I said no, but I'm grateful I was born in the US.

I guess I'm pretty shallow because I can only think: If GW's in favor of it, it must be wrong and bad and not good for us.

my two cents

r cubed said...

my dad was a vietnam vet and never recovered. Unfortunately he had kids so the tragedy gets passed on that way. What robert rouse said encouraged me--I hope these returning soldiers are getting psychiatric help for their own as well as their kids' sakes. Although I don't know that a pscyhe can really recover from war. I am nearly in tears with anger and sadness when I hear about soldiers coming home broke and homeless.

Italian Bird said...

great post.
I just hope that this war ends.

Dr. Monkey Von Monkerstein said...

Thanks for sharing about your family and your feelings on the war. I have a feeling if Bush and BUsh McCain had their eay the dang war would still be going on when your boys are grown.

Spartacus said...

CDP - I don't know anyone whose been in combat who cares to talk about their experiences. They would just as quickly change the subject. Do you blame them? I wrote about this a while back with regards to my father-in-law, but I used to work for a guy that was a Vietnam vet who had alot to say about life in the Army, but little or nothing to say about life in combat...if, in fact, one can call that living. Personally, I think you know the answer to the question you posed at the end of your post. Twenty or 40 years from now, they'll do what most combat veterans do -- clam up and keep it hidden.

CDP said...

Dcup--I'm afraid you're probably right

WM--I think that there would have been much more pressure on the administration, such as it is, to stay out of Iraq had there been any inkling that it would still be going in 5 years later.

Suze--I know. My cousin was in Desert Storm, and as tough as that was, I don't think it compares to the current war in terms of what the soldiers are going through

Cathy--I'm proud in the sense that I feel proud when we do the right thing as a country, which we've done many times. And I always feel fortunate, but it's there but for the grace of God, you know?
BTW, welcome!

R--you've written so movingly about your dad and what he suffered (and what your family suffered as a result). I agree, it just infuriates me when I hear of veterans arriving home after fighting this war and they can't get decent medical care, or they suffer PTSD and it's still not taken seriously.

IB--thanks, me too.

Dr. M.--I actually worry about that. Given that 5 years have passed, 11 more (my older one will be 18 in 11 years) does not seem at all outside the realm of possibility.

Spartacus--Oh, I hope not. We're still nowhere near where we need to be in understanding and compassion for sufferers of mental illness, but I think we're far ahead of where we were in the Vietnam era. I hope that the men and women coming home now will have an easier road ahead.

susan said...

cjhltYour post reminded me of something I witnessed in RI many years ago - likely 1985. Every year there was a festival around Memorial Day which ended with a big parade. Since Vietnam had never been declared an official war (we're actually had no official ones since WWII), the veterans of that conflict had never been invited to participate.

That year they had been for the first time. The floats, marching bands, old veterans, public officials, dancers and even the Mummers passed by to the great delight of the cheering crowd. Then everything got quiet. The Vietnam vets - still young men and wearing jungle camo - came close to the end of the parade. They walked silently and in their midst four of them carried a tiger cage - that terrible symbol of how the prisoners of war were kept. I wasn't the only one who cried.

At that time many people had blamed the soldiers for Vietnam but they were just victims too.

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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Anonymous said...

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